Quick Question that calls for update when/if we ever hear from Addie in [a] chapter[s], as I remember bro tom saying we would:
WhY is the novel titled As I Lay Dying?
Because so far, it makes more sense as As She Lay Dying? The narrative style, as discussed in another topic, is set for a reason. It is structured so that the reader understands the happenings and the moods and the death from each of the surrounding characters' eyes. However, Addie seems ominously present and aware because of the title. It is as if she is watching, observing, judging even. For instance, who does she really love [the most]? Who loved her? Would she appove of the manner in which her family and neighbors 'honored' her death??- sfa-c Feb 12, 2008
Well, the "I" can definitely refer to Addie, as I am sure it does. But, as you said, she is not speaking yet. So why is the title what it is? I may have an explanation. Maybe Addie isn't the only one dying. Maybe the whole family is dying. But by this, I do not mean physically. I mean spiritually. Death can shatter a person and a family, particularly a family. So maybe the "I" is the family. We can already see rising tension between the family members, after all. Yes, I know this is a stretch. But I think that it's wort a shot.- JHe-c Feb 12, 2008
Also, see the note on page 266.- brtom Feb 12, 2008
Although John may have a point, I think that if the author intended it that way, he would have titled it "As WE Lay Dying". I think that the author intended for the I to be Addie. Often times, the title of a book isn't understood until the middle of a book, or even the end. Just because we do not understand the title now, I'm sure we will by the end, and if not, it is a much more relevant topic then. As to what Sharon suggested about her presence in the novel because of the talk of who loves her the most or if she would approve of the manner in which her family and neighbors honored her, I disagree. I think that those situations are created by her friends and family and are quite superficial, almost self-centered. She isn't judging anyone, others just bring up these situations that don't really exist. I do not believe that Addie still cares about who she loved the most.- PSp-c Feb 12, 2008 I agree that the "I" in the title doesn’t have to refer to Addie. As far as the idea that the family is dying spiritually as a result of Addie’s death I have one question. What kind of spirituality did they have before Addie’s death and illness? It didn’t appear to me that the family is very spiritual. Also I don’t think that the Bundren family can be judges as a whole because each character’s spirituality is at a different level. For example, Anse seems to be the least spiritual. He is more concerned with getting new teeth than burying his wife. Cash is also very focused on the physical, but he turns to reason. Darl on the other hand is much for spiritual because he ponders the meaning of existence as does Vardaman on a more physical and childlike level. Each character is on a different spiritual journey and is at a different point on their road in life. I think that the title can still be based on the family’s spirituality, but I think that we have to look at it differently for every narrator. As humans they are always getting closer to death, but they cannot choose the time of their death either. It doesn’t have to be titled “As We Lay Dying” because the characters never speak together as a whole. I know that we cannot yet determine the whole meaning of the title, but this is my best guess. I think that Addie’s role in her chapters in this next section will also reveal something about the title of the novel.- bga-c Feb 18, 2008
As it was mentioned, Faulkner clearly knew what he was doing in titling the book; it's entirely possible that his meaning hasn't become clear to us yet and is based off an event yet to come. While Addie seems to be the ominous "I" that is dying, that is the only perspective we have been given so far and it may change as we read on. It still may be from Addie's perspective, because although she didn't have any speaking chapters in the book prior to her death, she said a lot through the other characters. It seemed that her looks and movements were registered by other people, and what she wanted or thought was clear through her family. I think she spoke a lot in her last days, with the looks she gave each other, and in her few chosen actions. Many times she was referred to as watching everything, almost like she's already gone from reality and is watching life go on around her, from a higher ground. It seems she could still be an omniscient presence in the book later on, but I think that the "I" may still be referring to another character or group or something, bigger than just one dying woman. - dru-c Feb 18, 2008
I think that the title definately does refer to Addie because the events are occuring as she is dying. However, then stands the question of how she can see everything from beyond the grave. The answer to that question is that she has the same power that Darl does. Just as Darl could describe in great detail the events of Addie's death when he was not even present, Addie can still see what is going on after her death. I strongly believe that Addie was what held the family together so as she dies she is also seeing the coherence of the family die as John was saying. Without a strong force telling everyone what to do, nothing is done well and there is much tension amongst the Bundrens. We see this as they are taking Addie's coffin to Jefferson: Jewel has no interest in riding with the family, he rides his horse instead. Then they get stuck in the river and it is all down hill from there.- mha-c Feb 21, 2008
I think the title "As I Lay Dying" is appropriate because it emphasizes the dominating 1st person style of the novel. In every chapter in this book, the story has come from a first person perspective. Even when Darl goes into the minds of other characters and seems to narrate, it is understood to be in first person. If the title were "as SHE lays dying," faulkner would have been abandoning his exploration of the completely first person narrative. Addie does seem ominous and present throughout the book. Though she is dead and almost an inadimate object, she is a character, just like the brief case we talked about in "The invisible Man," that experienced everything the main character experienced because it was always present. And addie does eventually get her chapter, if you haven't read it already.- MKo-c Feb 22, 2008
I think that the title comes about, as Mike mentioned, because though narrated by many, each is speaking from his own perspective. And I think this is especially appropriate given the end of the book, where we see the destruction that befalls the family. No one gets a happy ending, except Anse, and in my opinion, just having to live as Anse is punishment as it is. After all, the story really isn't about "As SHE Lay Dying," because she only lays there and dies for the first few chapters. The vast majority of the book happens after she did the laying and the dying, not AS she was doing it, and thus I don't think that the title really was referring to Addie. The title refers to all of the Bundrens (and perhaps everyone who narrates? I'm not sure about that idea, though...), because as they are carting Addie's body around, they really are paralyzed--they have no way to get out of the destructive situation they are in, which brings all of them to some demise at the end. Therefore, I think that "As I Lay Dying" refers to each of the characters' situation in the book. - lsi-c Feb 22, 2008
I think that the title of this book is very appropriate because we get a glimpse into every character's mind during this entire process of burying Addie. We know when each character suffers in their own way, what they're going through, and how they react to everyone else around them. I think that if it were just "As she lay dying" many more thoughts and actions would be focused on Addie and her coffin. The "I" in the title signifies each and every character's opinion, not to mention how they are suffering. We noted in class the other day how you begin dying the moment you're born. Not a very positive thought, but it rings true for a majority of the characters. For example, Darl goes insane towards the end. I'm sure from anyone's perspective, that is a form of dying. His sanity was killed or taken from him. Another character experiencing some sort of death might be Vardaman. After going through his mother's death, we recognized his sensitivity in small spaces, we watched him drill holes in her coffin, and we noticed how he follows Dewey Dell around all the time. All these things contribute to a greater realization he has towards his family. A part of him dies every time he sees another family member hurt. Because of these examples, the title of the book is appropriately spread out to cover each character. - bzw-c Feb 23, 2008
I had this same question, SFa, and what I came up with is that although Addie is the one who is physically dying, they are each dying in their own way. The title most directly refers to Addie, but if you look closer, it refers to each of the characters. Anse has a spiritual death throughout the novel. I would say that he was spiritually dead from the beginning, except for the fact that he gets worse throughout the novel from not caring about his wife's death other than to get his teeth, to remarrying within a week of her death. Darl has a mental death because he can't take the insanity of the situation anymore, Cash physically dies a little bit more with his leg injury, etc. etc. I think the word "lay" is also significant in the title because it shows that nobody is doing anything about their own "disease." The fact that they are laying, waiting to die shows that they have given up. But then again, maybe there was no hope for them to begin with. - LDo-c Feb 24, 2008
Yeah, the first thing I thought of after I finished the book was what does the title mean. I think that the I is Addie, and as she is laying there ready to go off into the next world, what is going on around her? The book consists of all the events from her illness to being put in the ground. I do think that LDo has a point though with the "I" refering to each of the characters and their own individual and unique deaths. This sort of contradicts Faulkner's message in his speech that expressed his faith that man will prevail because each character is dieing, which certainly does not correlate to dieing. However, we see through Jewel and Cash that the old traditional qualities that writers were beginning to neglate are alive. Are there any other different interpretations of the title? - kva-c Feb 25, 2008
I think that the "I" refers to Addie and the family, like many have said; however, I also think that the "I" can also refer to Faulkner and the way of life in the South that he grew up in. This theme of the dying old south is prevalent when the Bundrens reach Jefferson City. The majority of the novel appears to be set in the 1800s; however, as soon as the family reaches the city, it is revealed that the time period of the novel is really the current day--for when Faulkner wrote it. The way of life that the Bundrens know--the rural, agricultural, self-sufficient farmer--in the south is drawing to a close as the modernization of the north begins working its way down into the south. The fact is that the Bundrens journey to the big town might have been a last gasp of the old south mentalities, customs, and technology, before being introduced and engulfed by the modern city of Jefferson City. I'm sure that Faulkner was also referring to other things when he named this book, but I think that the dying old south was definitely one of the deeper meanings. - dsU-c Feb 25, 2008
All you have very apt interpretations of the title. It did seem strange to me that the novel would be named this because the events of the novel mostly occurred after Addie had died; only the beginning marked events in which Addie was dying. My only idea would be that Addie (aside from if she died from old age) died because her marriage to Anse was dead to her; even her relationships with her children were essentially dead. Thus, Addie had no reason to live if all that was supposed to be important to her was dead.
I too noticed what Brother Tom pointed out (p. 266): [AS I LAY DYING] When asked the source of his title, Faulkner would sometimes quote from memory the speech of Agamemnon to Odysseus in the Odyssey, Book XI: "As I lay dying the woman with the dog's eyes would not close my eyes for me as I descended into Hades."
In the above excerpt, Odysseus converses with Agamemnon in the underworld; Agamemnon was actually murdered by his wife Clytemnestra (thus the reference to the "woman with the dog's eyes"). But why would Faulkner choose this passage as influence for his novel? Honestly, in relating the epic to this novel, I find it rather difficult. Perhaps even though Addie has died, she cannot truly close her eyes because of her family member's continuing perspectives about her and her life. Any other ideas?
Even the back cover of the novel describes "The Bundren family's odyssey across the Mississippi countryside to bury Addie." Clearly the Odyssey greatly influenced Faulkner and As I Lay Dying. - AWr-c Feb 26, 2008
I can see it as just Addie personally. I mean Faulkner has all the characters tell the story, why not let a character pick the title? Addie is dead for most of the book, so maybe she is spectating the events that are taking place around her casket. There are other supernatural elements in the book like Darl's freaky good ESP. I really don't think it's too big a stretch to think that the I refers to Addie. I think it's stranger that she is dead for most of the book and in no way is "dying" but rather is just dead. So this is probably where this idea hits a roadblock. But really a title like this is kind of ambiguous and can easily be turned into meaning any of all your guy's valid ideas. Maybe the whole point of the title is to not have one meaning, but to evoke unique responses from different people.- mka-c Feb 27, 2008
I think perhaps mka is right. The title presents many different possibilities. However, if we are to consider the quote that AWr brought up I feel like there is another possibility. That quote immediately makes me think of Faulkner's Nobel Prize acceptance speech. In that he talks about universal truths and virtues. He also talks about man's fear of death. The title to me seems more like As I, the reader, Lay Dying. In this sense the novel can act as a prop to help man endure. It sorta gives the whole story purpose. Does anyone agree? - PMi-c Feb 27, 2008
Actually, PMi I do see your point. He does seem to be making a semi-commentary on death. I mean in his speech he speaks of how we are consumed by this fear of death, that we are constantly asking the question "When will I be blown up?" This is funny because I think part of his point is that we should be saying "Why will I be blown up?", but that is beside the point. The "I" in As I Lay Dying is literally, I think, Addie. She only gets her limited number of pages, but she still has pages. That is adding to the narrative quality and genius. We, the readers, are left to figure out what we think. Up to when she writes, I found myself waiting just to find out what she would say. Then, when she spoke, I found so many truths out. She is the voice of truth and of insight, that is why the title is for her, because she really is the center of the story; it is her body's trip to the burial. But, this could also be the whole "have hope, because life goes on after death." You never know...I never thought about it like that. - MFi-c Feb 28, 2008
WhY is the novel titled As I Lay Dying?
Because so far, it makes more sense as As She Lay Dying? The narrative style, as discussed in another topic, is set for a reason. It is structured so that the reader understands the happenings and the moods and the death from each of the surrounding characters' eyes. However, Addie seems ominously present and aware because of the title. It is as if she is watching, observing, judging even. For instance, who does she really love [the most]? Who loved her? Would she appove of the manner in which her family and neighbors 'honored' her death??-
Well, the "I" can definitely refer to Addie, as I am sure it does. But, as you said, she is not speaking yet. So why is the title what it is? I may have an explanation. Maybe Addie isn't the only one dying. Maybe the whole family is dying. But by this, I do not mean physically. I mean spiritually. Death can shatter a person and a family, particularly a family. So maybe the "I" is the family. We can already see rising tension between the family members, after all. Yes, I know this is a stretch. But I think that it's wort a shot.-
Also, see the note on page 266.-
Although John may have a point, I think that if the author intended it that way, he would have titled it "As WE Lay Dying". I think that the author intended for the I to be Addie. Often times, the title of a book isn't understood until the middle of a book, or even the end. Just because we do not understand the title now, I'm sure we will by the end, and if not, it is a much more relevant topic then. As to what Sharon suggested about her presence in the novel because of the talk of who loves her the most or if she would approve of the manner in which her family and neighbors honored her, I disagree. I think that those situations are created by her friends and family and are quite superficial, almost self-centered. She isn't judging anyone, others just bring up these situations that don't really exist. I do not believe that Addie still cares about who she loved the most.-
I agree that the "I" in the title doesn’t have to refer to Addie. As far as the idea that the family is dying spiritually as a result of Addie’s death I have one question. What kind of spirituality did they have before Addie’s death and illness? It didn’t appear to me that the family is very spiritual. Also I don’t think that the Bundren family can be judges as a whole because each character’s spirituality is at a different level. For example, Anse seems to be the least spiritual. He is more concerned with getting new teeth than burying his wife. Cash is also very focused on the physical, but he turns to reason. Darl on the other hand is much for spiritual because he ponders the meaning of existence as does Vardaman on a more physical and childlike level. Each character is on a different spiritual journey and is at a different point on their road in life. I think that the title can still be based on the family’s spirituality, but I think that we have to look at it differently for every narrator. As humans they are always getting closer to death, but they cannot choose the time of their death either. It doesn’t have to be titled “As We Lay Dying” because the characters never speak together as a whole. I know that we cannot yet determine the whole meaning of the title, but this is my best guess. I think that Addie’s role in her chapters in this next section will also reveal something about the title of the novel.-
As it was mentioned, Faulkner clearly knew what he was doing in titling the book; it's entirely possible that his meaning hasn't become clear to us yet and is based off an event yet to come. While Addie seems to be the ominous "I" that is dying, that is the only perspective we have been given so far and it may change as we read on. It still may be from Addie's perspective, because although she didn't have any speaking chapters in the book prior to her death, she said a lot through the other characters. It seemed that her looks and movements were registered by other people, and what she wanted or thought was clear through her family. I think she spoke a lot in her last days, with the looks she gave each other, and in her few chosen actions. Many times she was referred to as watching everything, almost like she's already gone from reality and is watching life go on around her, from a higher ground. It seems she could still be an omniscient presence in the book later on, but I think that the "I" may still be referring to another character or group or something, bigger than just one dying woman. -
I think that the title definately does refer to Addie because the events are occuring as she is dying. However, then stands the question of how she can see everything from beyond the grave. The answer to that question is that she has the same power that Darl does. Just as Darl could describe in great detail the events of Addie's death when he was not even present, Addie can still see what is going on after her death. I strongly believe that Addie was what held the family together so as she dies she is also seeing the coherence of the family die as John was saying. Without a strong force telling everyone what to do, nothing is done well and there is much tension amongst the Bundrens. We see this as they are taking Addie's coffin to Jefferson: Jewel has no interest in riding with the family, he rides his horse instead. Then they get stuck in the river and it is all down hill from there.-
I think the title "As I Lay Dying" is appropriate because it emphasizes the dominating 1st person style of the novel. In every chapter in this book, the story has come from a first person perspective. Even when Darl goes into the minds of other characters and seems to narrate, it is understood to be in first person. If the title were "as SHE lays dying," faulkner would have been abandoning his exploration of the completely first person narrative. Addie does seem ominous and present throughout the book. Though she is dead and almost an inadimate object, she is a character, just like the brief case we talked about in "The invisible Man," that experienced everything the main character experienced because it was always present. And addie does eventually get her chapter, if you haven't read it already.-
I think that the title comes about, as Mike mentioned, because though narrated by many, each is speaking from his own perspective. And I think this is especially appropriate given the end of the book, where we see the destruction that befalls the family. No one gets a happy ending, except Anse, and in my opinion, just having to live as Anse is punishment as it is. After all, the story really isn't about "As SHE Lay Dying," because she only lays there and dies for the first few chapters. The vast majority of the book happens after she did the laying and the dying, not AS she was doing it, and thus I don't think that the title really was referring to Addie. The title refers to all of the Bundrens (and perhaps everyone who narrates? I'm not sure about that idea, though...), because as they are carting Addie's body around, they really are paralyzed--they have no way to get out of the destructive situation they are in, which brings all of them to some demise at the end. Therefore, I think that "As I Lay Dying" refers to each of the characters' situation in the book. -
I think that the title of this book is very appropriate because we get a glimpse into every character's mind during this entire process of burying Addie. We know when each character suffers in their own way, what they're going through, and how they react to everyone else around them. I think that if it were just "As she lay dying" many more thoughts and actions would be focused on Addie and her coffin. The "I" in the title signifies each and every character's opinion, not to mention how they are suffering. We noted in class the other day how you begin dying the moment you're born. Not a very positive thought, but it rings true for a majority of the characters. For example, Darl goes insane towards the end. I'm sure from anyone's perspective, that is a form of dying. His sanity was killed or taken from him. Another character experiencing some sort of death might be Vardaman. After going through his mother's death, we recognized his sensitivity in small spaces, we watched him drill holes in her coffin, and we noticed how he follows Dewey Dell around all the time. All these things contribute to a greater realization he has towards his family. A part of him dies every time he sees another family member hurt. Because of these examples, the title of the book is appropriately spread out to cover each character. -
I had this same question, SFa, and what I came up with is that although Addie is the one who is physically dying, they are each dying in their own way. The title most directly refers to Addie, but if you look closer, it refers to each of the characters. Anse has a spiritual death throughout the novel. I would say that he was spiritually dead from the beginning, except for the fact that he gets worse throughout the novel from not caring about his wife's death other than to get his teeth, to remarrying within a week of her death. Darl has a mental death because he can't take the insanity of the situation anymore, Cash physically dies a little bit more with his leg injury, etc. etc. I think the word "lay" is also significant in the title because it shows that nobody is doing anything about their own "disease." The fact that they are laying, waiting to die shows that they have given up. But then again, maybe there was no hope for them to begin with.
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Yeah, the first thing I thought of after I finished the book was what does the title mean. I think that the I is Addie, and as she is laying there ready to go off into the next world, what is going on around her? The book consists of all the events from her illness to being put in the ground. I do think that LDo has a point though with the "I" refering to each of the characters and their own individual and unique deaths. This sort of contradicts Faulkner's message in his speech that expressed his faith that man will prevail because each character is dieing, which certainly does not correlate to dieing. However, we see through Jewel and Cash that the old traditional qualities that writers were beginning to neglate are alive. Are there any other different interpretations of the title?
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I think that the "I" refers to Addie and the family, like many have said; however, I also think that the "I" can also refer to Faulkner and the way of life in the South that he grew up in. This theme of the dying old south is prevalent when the Bundrens reach Jefferson City. The majority of the novel appears to be set in the 1800s; however, as soon as the family reaches the city, it is revealed that the time period of the novel is really the current day--for when Faulkner wrote it. The way of life that the Bundrens know--the rural, agricultural, self-sufficient farmer--in the south is drawing to a close as the modernization of the north begins working its way down into the south. The fact is that the Bundrens journey to the big town might have been a last gasp of the old south mentalities, customs, and technology, before being introduced and engulfed by the modern city of Jefferson City. I'm sure that Faulkner was also referring to other things when he named this book, but I think that the dying old south was definitely one of the deeper meanings.
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All you have very apt interpretations of the title. It did seem strange to me that the novel would be named this because the events of the novel mostly occurred after Addie had died; only the beginning marked events in which Addie was dying. My only idea would be that Addie (aside from if she died from old age) died because her marriage to Anse was dead to her; even her relationships with her children were essentially dead. Thus, Addie had no reason to live if all that was supposed to be important to her was dead.
I too noticed what Brother Tom pointed out (p. 266): [AS I LAY DYING] When asked the source of his title, Faulkner would sometimes quote from memory the speech of Agamemnon to Odysseus in the Odyssey, Book XI: "As I lay dying the woman with the dog's eyes would not close my eyes for me as I descended into Hades."
In the above excerpt, Odysseus converses with Agamemnon in the underworld; Agamemnon was actually murdered by his wife Clytemnestra (thus the reference to the "woman with the dog's eyes"). But why would Faulkner choose this passage as influence for his novel? Honestly, in relating the epic to this novel, I find it rather difficult. Perhaps even though Addie has died, she cannot truly close her eyes because of her family member's continuing perspectives about her and her life. Any other ideas?
Even the back cover of the novel describes "The Bundren family's odyssey across the Mississippi countryside to bury Addie." Clearly the Odyssey greatly influenced Faulkner and As I Lay Dying. -
I can see it as just Addie personally. I mean Faulkner has all the characters tell the story, why not let a character pick the title? Addie is dead for most of the book, so maybe she is spectating the events that are taking place around her casket. There are other supernatural elements in the book like Darl's freaky good ESP. I really don't think it's too big a stretch to think that the I refers to Addie. I think it's stranger that she is dead for most of the book and in no way is "dying" but rather is just dead. So this is probably where this idea hits a roadblock. But really a title like this is kind of ambiguous and can easily be turned into meaning any of all your guy's valid ideas. Maybe the whole point of the title is to not have one meaning, but to evoke unique responses from different people.-
I think perhaps mka is right. The title presents many different possibilities. However, if we are to consider the quote that AWr brought up I feel like there is another possibility. That quote immediately makes me think of Faulkner's Nobel Prize acceptance speech. In that he talks about universal truths and virtues. He also talks about man's fear of death. The title to me seems more like As I, the reader, Lay Dying. In this sense the novel can act as a prop to help man endure. It sorta gives the whole story purpose. Does anyone agree? -
Actually, PMi I do see your point. He does seem to be making a semi-commentary on death. I mean in his speech he speaks of how we are consumed by this fear of death, that we are constantly asking the question "When will I be blown up?" This is funny because I think part of his point is that we should be saying "Why will I be blown up?", but that is beside the point. The "I" in As I Lay Dying is literally, I think, Addie. She only gets her limited number of pages, but she still has pages. That is adding to the narrative quality and genius. We, the readers, are left to figure out what we think. Up to when she writes, I found myself waiting just to find out what she would say. Then, when she spoke, I found so many truths out. She is the voice of truth and of insight, that is why the title is for her, because she really is the center of the story; it is her body's trip to the burial. But, this could also be the whole "have hope, because life goes on after death." You never know...I never thought about it like that.
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